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Sam Reed
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Posted: Wed Nov 4th, 2009 03:41 am |
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I haven't been around for quite a while, but I figured it was time to drift back in when I picked these up at an auction this weekend. First up is a little R&M, I haven't cleaned the plate off enough to find the model number, though it appears to be from the late 20s.
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Sam Reed
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Posted: Wed Nov 4th, 2009 03:45 am |
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Second is an Emerson 17666 - brass blades, brass cage, built like a main battle tank! Unfortunately it's missing one part that I know will be hard to locate - one of the brass wing bolts that holds the motor to the yoke. It also doesn't have a bottom plate over the speed control like most Emersons I've seen, but I've also noticed that the very few restored examples I've been able to find on the web all seem to have a wooden base. That would seem to indicate that there is a need to close off the bottom.
Yes, it has rust on the brass blades and cage - these poor things were stored in a wet environment and something flaked on it. The cage has a separated crimp at the bottom that someone tried to solder, and it's a bit torqued out of shape. Though I'm an incorrigible DIYer, I might have the cage put back in order by a professional.
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Sam Reed
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Posted: Wed Nov 4th, 2009 03:47 am |
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Back of the Emerson.
As bad as the rust looks on the base, the speed control seems to be in very nice shape. I haven't opened the motor to take a look, nor have I tried to start it up. The original cords are in good solid condition, but they will be replaced in the restoration.
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Sam Reed
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Posted: Wed Nov 4th, 2009 03:48 am |
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Data tag for the 17666.
You can barely buy dinner at Taco Bell for what I paid for the pair. 
If anyone has any detailed information, or restoration tips, hints and tricks for either of these, I'd appreciate the advice.
Also, if anyone knows exactly what the model and date of production are for the R&M, I'd greatly appreciate the ID. From the limited info I've found, the R&M tentatively dates to around 1928 and the Emerson is likely from 1913, based on similar model numbers in use at the time.
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 Last edited on Wed Nov 4th, 2009 03:54 am by Sam Reed
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Austin B Ko
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Posted: Wed Nov 4th, 2009 03:50 am |
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| Nice finds. Even though they look like they went to heck and back I bet you they still work as the day they left the factory.
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Steve Stephens
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Posted: Wed Nov 4th, 2009 04:04 am |
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| Sam, your Emerson should restore up nicely. Unless you want to keep it's patina intact. But you'd be crazy to do so. That fan is begging for a nice restoration. The wing bolt you need shouldn't be that hard to find since they were common on so many Emersons. Forget a wood base; these fans didn't have them. A black fiber cover was used over the switch on all but the earliest models and you may be able to get one properly cut from Darryl Hudson. Check out the restoration section. If you can't find it let me know.
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Sam Reed
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Posted: Wed Nov 4th, 2009 04:08 am |
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Steve, thanks for that info!
I just tried the Emerson on a dim-bulb tester I use for initial tests of vintage audio equipment - on two speeds I'm getting a dead short, and nothing at all from the third. I'll have to dig into it to find where the problem lies, hopefully it's nothing too serious. Considering the storage conditions, I'm betting on damaged wiring. If necessary, I have a four-blade steel/steel Emerson from the early 20s that could cough up a speed controller.
The bearing on the Emerson spins quite nicely.
The R&M wasn't tested as the cord is crumbled and I didn't feel like blasting myself with 124VAC.
Last edited on Wed Nov 4th, 2009 04:09 am by Sam Reed
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Steve Stephens
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Posted: Wed Nov 4th, 2009 04:29 am |
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Sam Reed wrote:
If necessary, I have a four-blade steel/steel Emerson from the early 20s that could cough up a speed controller.
Maybe not Sam. Speed coils sometimes differed on different models I think. I don't know the details but something to check out before you attempt a swap. Am I correct on this motor experts?
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Sam Reed
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Posted: Wed Nov 4th, 2009 04:35 am |
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Knowing the durability of most Emerson components, I'm betting that the bad storage has caused some serious wiring damage and the controller is OK.
Anyone have an idea of what sort of resistance readings I should get from the speed controller at each setting?
Last edited on Wed Nov 4th, 2009 04:36 am by Sam Reed
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Fred Berry
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Posted: Wed Nov 4th, 2009 01:31 pm |
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I'm gonna hazard a guess: The headwire, where it goes into the motor. It looks pretty badly chewed up right there. I think this is where your dead short is. I'm sure that the motor and speed coil are OK.
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Sam Reed
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Posted: Thu Nov 5th, 2009 02:49 am |
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The wires are very frayed (including the lovely sight of exposed wiring) where they enter the motor housing. I pulled them apart to ensure no contact in the bad areas and it didn't help. I'm getting a hum on the two speeds that are showing a short, like it wants to run, but nothing, even with a nudge.
I'm going to start taking pictures to document the disassembly - I want to get the speed coil out for testing (it obviously has problems, only two speeds are making contact) and get into the motor housing to check out the windings. More to report in a little while.
Update:
Everything is now stripped down. The stator appears to be in good shape, but I did find out why nothing happened on the high speed setting - one of the two paired headwires was completely broken. All three were frayed into nothingness where they passed through the case grommet.
The speed coil also seems to be in good shape, but the wire leading out of the coil to the motor has lost it's insulation all the way down to the coil. I think soldering a new lead to the damaged wire, then shoving a piece of heat shrink tubing all the way down should suffice to re-insulate.
What's the best way of cleaning the stator and speed coil? I'd like to get them clean and looking good again (both are caked with 95 years of crud), but I don't want to damage the insulation.
Can anyone recommend a restorer who can get the cage back into shape for a reasonable fee? There are no breaks in the wire, it's just somewhat torqued out of shape and the lower front wire joint has slid out of the crimp.
Update 2: Huzzah! After marking the wires and cutting most of the crumbling sections off, I checked the speed coil and stator with my multimeter - everything is showing sensible readings! No shorts! 95 years with an unknown portion of that time apparently in a swamp, and this thing is still going to work!
Also, I was able to get both of the intact threaded plastic grommets out safely, which surprised me. Every one I've tried to remove from a newer Emerson has crumbled.
Last edited on Thu Nov 5th, 2009 05:56 am by Sam Reed
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