| Author | Post |
|---|
Russ Huber
AFCA Member
| Joined: | Mon Nov 14th, 2005 |
| Location: | Southwest, Wisconsin USA |
| Posts: | 4954 |
| Favorite Fan: | Any with all its parts. |
| Status: |
Offline
|
|
Posted: Sun Apr 12th, 2009 08:09 am |
|
Hey...for you newbies out there.  When you find your first BMY(fan collector slang for the G.E. BIG MOTOR YOKE) your gonna jump up and give a high five to the closest human being next to you.  Actually...these early fans are fairly plentiful in the wild....yes they are....and hardy fans ta boot. 
Now...when you wander into the wild or an antique shop and nail your first G.ood E.nough BMY....there are some differences.  The one on the far left is the earliest......the right...the latest version. The last G.E. Pancake to be introduced was 08. The first CENTRIFUGAL START MOTOR BMY pictured on the left first appeared in 08. Early centrifugal start motors make a "clickety" sound when starting up and at the end revolutions of the shut down.
Easy way to tell the earliest BMYs....the FLAT BRASS cage struts are mounted to the FRONT of the motor. The next BMY model had FLAT BRASS cage struts BENT IN A "L" shape mounted at the top of the motor housing. The next and last BMY STATIONARY had what is called in Don Eckerson's G.E. survey as a hardier.....PROFILE STRUT. This means in a nut shell.....the strut was not flat. The later strut had a molded ridge in the backside center of the strut...can't miss it.  .
Another way to tell is LOOK AT THEM. The earliest Centrifugal BMY has no pivot knuckle. Just like a Westy tank...all the motor head can do is rotate, or swivel up and down in the yoke. Now...the other later two can not only rotate, but have pivot knuckles allowing increased up and down movement of the fan head.
Do check out the how they grow in height.
Steveo will tell you the rest...I bet.  Happy Easter to all! 
Attached Image (viewed 449 times):
 Last edited on Sun Apr 12th, 2009 08:19 am by Russ Huber
|
Alex Hart
AFCA Member
| Joined: | Sun Mar 1st, 2009 |
| Location: | Carlisle, United Kingdom |
| Posts: | 621 |
| Favorite Fan: | GE / ECK/ Century skel / verity's |
| Status: |
Offline
|
|
Posted: Sun Apr 12th, 2009 11:50 am |
|
| This is useful as i keep looking for my first but get a little confused with not only dating them but between BMY AND SMY Cos i"ve never seen one in the flesh its hard to see the difference!
|
William Drabble
AFCA Member
| Joined: | Sat Jun 17th, 2006 |
| Location: | Southampton, United Kingdom |
| Posts: | 424 |
| Favorite Fan: | Anything before 1900 |
| Status: |
Offline
|
|
Posted: Sun Apr 12th, 2009 01:45 pm |
|
My first 'proper' old fan was a 1912 BMY. I remember it cost me next to nothing and the postage, even for something that substantial, was cheap back then. The old girl was covered in about a inch of grease but I spent many hours stripping it down, cleaning and re-assembling. Still didn't look that great in the end but it gave me a lot of practice in the art of fan restoration and it was the first so I would't part with it.
By the way Alex, when you have seen the bare insides of an Emerson, and that famous single bearing, you will find it hard to look at another Good Enough
Last edited on Sun Apr 12th, 2009 08:52 pm by William Drabble
|
Alex Hart
AFCA Member
| Joined: | Sun Mar 1st, 2009 |
| Location: | Carlisle, United Kingdom |
| Posts: | 621 |
| Favorite Fan: | GE / ECK/ Century skel / verity's |
| Status: |
Offline
|
|
Posted: Sun Apr 12th, 2009 02:34 pm |
|
So wiliam what fans do you have in your collection? Just wondered what your fav was?
P.s Again Russ that avatar does make me smile!Last edited on Sun Apr 12th, 2009 02:35 pm by Alex Hart
|
Steve Stephens
AFCA Member
| Joined: | Mon Nov 14th, 2005 |
| Location: | San Anselmo, California USA |
| Posts: | 3598 |
| Favorite Fan: | Peerless bipolar |
| Status: |
Offline
|
|
Posted: Mon Apr 13th, 2009 06:28 am |
|
Russ Huber wrote:
Steveo will tell you the rest...I bet.
I dunno Russ, I'm resting now. Hey, you covered the BMYs really nicely. I might add or clarify on the first model (08-09) that it can pivot up and down some in its trunnion but can't be wall mounted as can the second (1910) and third (1911-12 plus '13 for only the 16" model) versions with their pivot knuckles. Best model to get?
All of them? They are just different, especially the fist with start switch. The second and third versions were available in a 6 blade version but not the first version. These fans were never pin striped! (Had to get that in) and their blades and cages were not "polished" but had some kind of gilt like finish on them. Russ, you say that you removed gold PAINT from the blade and cage of one? I don't know what finish it is but GE didn't use a highly polished brass finish on their fans from at least the BMY till c.1919 or 20 when they were highly polished and lacquered till the end of brass blades.
Badges were gold until the 3 star came out with a badge with the background painted black. Well, I'm getting off the topic now...
BMY vs the SMY? Best way to tell, especially if you are only looking at a photo, is to look at the REAR of the fan. The four bolts/nuts holding the motor together will be directly OUTSIDE of the motor vent holes. On the small motor yoke the screws (no acorn nuts on the SMY) are INSIDE (BETWEEN) the motor vent holes. DON'T compare in the front of the motor cause the two are the same; between the vent holes. Is it the 1913 model 16" BMY that has screws and no acorn nuts? Or, maybe, the 1912? I'm pretty sure that the last of the BMYs had no acorn nuts, just screws. Drives me nuts trying to figure this all out. Remember that both the BIG and SMALL motor YOKES sit in a yoke. Not so with the later motors with no yokes. BMYs have drop ring cages. SMYs have parallel ring cages EXCEPT for the first ones (at least the 12" fan) that do have a drop ring cage. But, the small motor yoke drop ring cage has a reverse curve at the bottom rear ring and the BMY cages have no reverse curve except on the 16" ones. Remember all that ok?
Anyone like the BMY? Probably, but I find them noisy with magnetic whine that makes me want to operate other fans. I've never had a fully serviced BMY unless it was my recent 6 winger. It, too, had that magnetic noise. The older pancakes are far more pleasing to run and sound like an airplane taking off but no magnetic noise. I think the 16' BMY is pretty impressive with it's hefty cage though. I would not mind if I did not have a BMY in my collection.Last edited on Mon Apr 13th, 2009 06:29 am by Steve Stephens
|
Russ Huber
AFCA Member
| Joined: | Mon Nov 14th, 2005 |
| Location: | Southwest, Wisconsin USA |
| Posts: | 4954 |
| Favorite Fan: | Any with all its parts. |
| Status: |
Offline
|
|
Posted: Mon Apr 13th, 2009 07:06 am |
|
Steve Stephens wrote: Russ Huber wrote:
Steveo will tell you the rest...I bet.
I dunno Russ, I'm resting now. Hey, you covered the BMYs really nicely. I might add or clarify on the first model (08-09) that it can pivot up and down some in its trunnion but can't be wall mounted as can the second (1910) and third (1911-12 plus '13 for only the 16" model) versions with their pivot knuckles. Best model to get?
All of them? They are just different, especially the fist with start switch. The second and third versions were available in a 6 blade version but not the first version. These fans were never pin striped! (Had to get that in) and their blades and cages were not "polished" but had some kind of gilt like finish on them. Russ, you say that you removed gold PAINT from the blade and cage of one? I don't know what finish it is but GE didn't use a highly polished brass finish on their fans from at least the BMY till c.1919 or 20 when they were highly polished and lacquered till the end of brass blades.
Badges were gold until the 3 star came out with a badge with the background painted black. Well, I'm getting off the topic now...
BMY vs the SMY? Best way to tell, especially if you are only looking at a photo, is to look at the REAR of the fan. The four bolts/nuts holding the motor together will be directly OUTSIDE of the motor vent holes. On the small motor yoke the screws (no acorn nuts on the SMY) are INSIDE (BETWEEN) the motor vent holes. DON'T compare in the front of the motor cause the two are the same; between the vent holes. Is it the 1913 model 16" BMY that has screws and no acorn nuts? Or, maybe, the 1912? I'm pretty sure that the last of the BMYs had no acorn nuts, just screws. Drives me nuts trying to figure this all out. Remember that both the BIG and SMALL motor YOKES sit in a yoke. Not so with the later motors with no yokes. BMYs have drop ring cages. SMYs have parallel ring cages EXCEPT for the first ones (at least the 12" fan) that do have a drop ring cage. But, the small motor yoke drop ring cage has a reverse curve at the bottom rear ring and the BMY cages have no reverse curve except on the 16" ones. Remember all that ok?
Anyone like the BMY? Probably, but I find them noisy with magnetic whine that makes me want to operate other fans. I've never had a fully serviced BMY unless it was my recent 6 winger. It, too, had that magnetic noise. The older pancakes are far more pleasing to run and sound like an airplane taking off but no magnetic noise. I think the 16' BMY is pretty impressive with it's hefty cage though. I would not mind if I did not have a BMY in my collection.
WoW Steve, you wrote a novel. Quote: "Russ, you say that you removed gold PAINT from the blade and cage of one?" Ya sorta, but not a BMY.... I soaked the CAGE AND STRUTS of an 05 cake pictured in parts cleaner. I killed the patina Steveo.  Attached Image (viewed 335 times):
 Last edited on Mon Apr 13th, 2009 07:08 am by Russ Huber
|
Steve Stephens
AFCA Member
| Joined: | Mon Nov 14th, 2005 |
| Location: | San Anselmo, California USA |
| Posts: | 3598 |
| Favorite Fan: | Peerless bipolar |
| Status: |
Offline
|
|
Posted: Mon Apr 13th, 2009 07:19 am |
|
Whatever GE finished the brass with on the BMY I think they did also on pancakes from at least 1899 onward. What do you think Russ? What is it?
I'm fairly sure that the blades were lacquered or dipped in something that leaves a thin line on one side of the blade with a thicker coat as it was dripping dry.
I'll have to give you some tips on using the "quote" feature. Hint; get rid of all of the post except what's of special interest that you want to comment on. No need to quote a whole post in most cases. Happy Easter.
SteveLast edited on Mon Apr 13th, 2009 07:22 am by Steve Stephens
|
Russ Huber
AFCA Member
| Joined: | Mon Nov 14th, 2005 |
| Location: | Southwest, Wisconsin USA |
| Posts: | 4954 |
| Favorite Fan: | Any with all its parts. |
| Status: |
Offline
|
|
Posted: Mon Apr 13th, 2009 07:41 am |
|
Steve Stephens wrote: Whatever GE finished the brass with on the BMY I think they did also on pancakes from at least 1899 onward. What do you think Russ? What is it?
Steve
All I know is the cage and struts on the 05 pictured had original brass paint over them. The paint had fine gold color metal flakes in it. The blade was not painted.
The earliest G.E. cake I will admit to having was a 99. It had NO paint on the brass...just heavy patina.
|
Russ Huber
AFCA Member
| Joined: | Mon Nov 14th, 2005 |
| Location: | Southwest, Wisconsin USA |
| Posts: | 4954 |
| Favorite Fan: | Any with all its parts. |
| Status: |
Offline
|
|
Posted: Mon Apr 13th, 2009 07:49 am |
|
The older pancakes are far more pleasing to run and sound like an airplane taking off but no magnetic noise. I think the 16' BMY is pretty impressive with it's hefty cage though.
Your wish is my command. You can have a 08-09 with sorta patina... or without patina..... for the right price. Attached Image (viewed 331 times):
|
Russ Huber
AFCA Member
| Joined: | Mon Nov 14th, 2005 |
| Location: | Southwest, Wisconsin USA |
| Posts: | 4954 |
| Favorite Fan: | Any with all its parts. |
| Status: |
Offline
|
|
Posted: Mon Apr 13th, 2009 07:50 am |
|
Sorta patina. Psssst.......Happy belated Easter to you to Steve...Bye now!  Attached Image (viewed 328 times):
 Last edited on Mon Apr 13th, 2009 08:06 am by Russ Huber
|
Fred Berry
AFCA Member
| Joined: | Thu Nov 17th, 2005 |
| Location: | Alexandria, Virginia USA |
| Posts: | 713 |
| Favorite Fan: | Shabby Roses & Hello Kitty |
| Status: |
Offline
|
|
Posted: Mon Apr 13th, 2009 02:30 pm |
|
Anyone like the BMY? Probably, but I find them noisy with magnetic whine that makes me want to operate other fans.
I wonder why the BMY's have this weird magnetic hum, especially on high speed, but the SMY's (at least my SMY) doesn't.
Russ, I have seen three different style 1st-gen SMY's: two that have the headwire coming into the front of the motor and each has a different style of centrifugal switch. The other style is like yours and mine, with the headwire coming into the rear of the motor. I noted that in our galleries section, the 1st BMY listed there is a franken-fan? 1st-gen BMY w/rear headwire, and a 6-wing blade which they didn't come with. Also, on the true 6-pole motor BMY's, the internal stator (not motor case) is longer and the rear windings are practically touching the rear end bell of the motor. See photo, 6-winger.
Attached Image (viewed 297 times):
|
Erich Martin
AFCA Member
| Joined: | Mon Aug 18th, 2008 |
| Location: | Westside, California USA |
| Posts: | 744 |
| Favorite Fan: | Westy tank |
| Status: |
Offline
|
|
Posted: Mon Apr 13th, 2009 03:02 pm |
|
Fan porn.....
|
Ryan Brescoe
AFCA Member
| Joined: | Thu Jun 7th, 2007 |
| Location: | Plymouth, Michigan USA |
| Posts: | 94 |
| Favorite Fan: | Century S3, GE BMY (split-phase motor) |
| Status: |
Offline
|
|
Posted: Mon Apr 13th, 2009 10:38 pm |
|
You guys are killing me with the complaints about the whine. That is magnetic music. I actually seek fans out based upon this. Quiet blade + whiny motor = a good night's sleep for me.
whining,
Ryan
|
Fred Berry
AFCA Member
| Joined: | Thu Nov 17th, 2005 |
| Location: | Alexandria, Virginia USA |
| Posts: | 713 |
| Favorite Fan: | Shabby Roses & Hello Kitty |
| Status: |
Offline
|
|
Posted: Tue Apr 14th, 2009 05:33 pm |
|
You guys are killing me with the complaints about the whine.
I NEVER complain about the magnetic hum of a motor! I LOVE that sound. I am just curious as to why the BMY styled motors made that ghostly whining while the similar SMY motors tended to be silent. If I turn my BMY 6-winger to 2nd or 3rd speeds, the motor goes silent, and the blades ARE silent. Same with my Hunter Kidney 6-winger, which uses a GE BMY motor. Both motors sound the same. And the above-mentioned BMY's with internal starting switches...Wow!...When you start them, the motor makes a very pronounced, loud magnetic hum that fades as the centrifugal switch opens. Good stuff!
I have slept with a Century repulsion-start, induction-run motor running all nite...the magnetic music is among the finest you can hear.
My alternating current 6-wing Westinghouse tanks also have a distinctive motor whine while running on high speed. Not as loud as the BMY, but it is there.
Another whiner is the Emerson 1310. Even after the gargantuan, heavy brass centrifugal blades have lifted off the stationary element, the motor produces a pleasant humming.
|
Steve Stephens
AFCA Member
| Joined: | Mon Nov 14th, 2005 |
| Location: | San Anselmo, California USA |
| Posts: | 3598 |
| Favorite Fan: | Peerless bipolar |
| Status: |
Offline
|
|
Posted: Tue Apr 14th, 2009 05:45 pm |
|
Fred Berry wrote:
My alternating current 6-wing Westinghouse tanks also have a distinctive motor whine while running on high speed. Not as loud as the BMY, but it is there.
We all must have the sounds that are pleasant and unpleasant to each of us. 12" GE pancakes aren't silent but have, to me, a wonderful sound of a prop plane taking off. My 6 wing tank is very quiet and I wouldn't say it has any wine or any objectional motor noise. That's one quiet and smooth running fan that's currently a weekly or more often user in my kitchen. Those BMYs just drone on too much for me. So I like classical, not jazz...
Russ, do you have the three different heights of 16" BMY? That is, if they made three heights of bases like they did with the 12". If so will you measure each motor pivot height and post here. I'd like to compare with the 12" pivot heights. Thanks...and tanks rule.Last edited on Tue Apr 14th, 2009 05:47 pm by Steve Stephens
|
Russ Huber
AFCA Member
| Joined: | Mon Nov 14th, 2005 |
| Location: | Southwest, Wisconsin USA |
| Posts: | 4954 |
| Favorite Fan: | Any with all its parts. |
| Status: |
Offline
|
|
Posted: Wed Apr 15th, 2009 07:59 am |
|
Steve Stephens wrote: Russ, do you have the three different heights of 16" BMY? That is, if they made three heights of bases like they did with the 12". If so will you measure each motor pivot height and post here. I'd like to compare with the 12" pivot heights. Thanks...and tanks rule.
No, I have two 08 16" model BMYs. However, if you check out Don Eckerson's 16" flat "L"mount strut in the gallery he has a ruler to show pivot height on the side shot. My 08 16" appears to be at the same pivot height as Don's second variant 16" BMY with pivot knuckle. I would feel very confident the 3rd variant 16"BMY without seeing it would have been at 11 3/8 pivot( just a tad higher). Facts are, you could take the blade and cage off of a 12" profile strut BMY and slap on a 16" blade and cage and still have proper clearance between the bottom cage and base.
|
Shane Hunt
Guest
| Joined: | Sun Sep 13th, 2009 |
| Location: | Auckland, New Zealand |
| Posts: | 27 |
| Favorite Fan: | GEC 8" Rubber Blade |
| Status: |
Offline
|
|
Posted: Tue Oct 6th, 2009 05:24 am |
|
With reference to the first post in this thread, I am using my very first AFCA post to give GE collectors a figurative high five as I have aquired my first BMY. (Got to run it on a stepdown converter though.) In terrific condition, it has polished brass blades - but no pinstripes!!!
On the topic of GE fans, I am not (yet) a member and was wondering if somewhere in the restricted section there was information, like that contained in this thread, that covers the variations (and matching years) for the little GE Whiz fans?
If not, would Steve, or some other knowledgeable person be willing to give us a rundown?
|
Steve Stephens
AFCA Member
| Joined: | Mon Nov 14th, 2005 |
| Location: | San Anselmo, California USA |
| Posts: | 3598 |
| Favorite Fan: | Peerless bipolar |
| Status: |
Offline
|
|
Posted: Tue Oct 6th, 2009 06:10 am |
|
Shane, welcome to the forum. As a member you'll get access to the larger photos in the gallery instead of the thumbnails. There are a small slew of GE Whizzzzesss in there. I'm not a real whiz on the Whiz fans though I do have a few. Nice fans though and can be really pretty restored.
I think you would be pleased to be a member. Our magazine is a super affair with color photos and comes to us every two months.
So you are a "rubber blade" afficianado? I guess that's ok. My first fan when I was two was a rubber blade Samson that got caught in the curtains when I was napping. Scared me half to death but I'm lovin the fans still. No rubber ones here though at present.
Everyone should have a BMY fan and now you got yours. How do you like it when running? I'm sure there are some that are quieter than others but I don't think I got one of them unfortunately. The good part about the BMY's are the number of variations available and the relative ease of finding many of the varietys. Plus they are affordable and robust. At least they are just good enough for Russ.
You have to run your fan on a step down converter? You must live in England or Europe? 220 v? Russ, any 220 volt BMYs around? I know you've got a 220 pancake.Last edited on Tue Oct 6th, 2009 06:12 am by Steve Stephens
|
Current time is 07:16 pm | |
|